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Weltenseite
Oct 4, 2016 12:25
7 yrs ago
German term

Verwurstung

German to English Art/Literary General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters Title of book
This is in the title of a book about Johann Georg Elser, the man who tried to blow up Hitler in the Munich bierkeller. The full title is: Georg Elser oder die Verwurstung des faehigsten Hitlergegner. All suggestiongs gratefully appreciated. Many thanks in advance for your ideas.
Proposed translations (English)
4 +1 Instrumentalization
3 +1 distorted legacy
3 hack-up/mangling
3 salamification
3 demolition
3 The Mincing of Georg Elser - Hitlers most capable opponent
3 making sawdust of/cutting G.E. down to size

Discussion

Paul Cohen Oct 12, 2016:
In for a penny, in for a pound Michael and Liane, thanks very much for your comments and insights. I've decided to formally enter the fray.
Liane Poost Oct 12, 2016:

A synonym for "verwursten" could be "ausschlachten".
http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/ausschlachten
- die Eingeweide von geschlachtetem Vieh herausnehmen
- (umgangssprachlich) die noch brauchbaren Teile aus etwas ausbauen
- (umgangssprachlich abwertend) bedenkenlos für seine Zwecke ausnutzen

Tanslations are there:
http://www.dict.cc/?s=ausschlachten
Michael Martin, MA Oct 12, 2016:
@Paul I believe your earlier suggestion of 'instrumentalization' would be much better than 'exploitation'. 'Exploitation is too broad, in my opinion. 'Instrumentalization' cuts closer to the bone.
Paul Cohen Oct 11, 2016:
Exploitation I'm normally not one to encourage 'exploitation' in any form, but if you suggest it as an answer, Alexandra, I'd be happy to give it an ‘agree’ (despite the fact that it lacks the [red] meat that much of the carnivorous crowd is braying for). ;-)
Alexandra Timms (X) Oct 11, 2016:
Exploitation Having read the article, I think that Brigitte's suggestion of "exploitation" is probably the best fit.
thefastshow Oct 10, 2016:
I oppose - it was a horribly meaty affair therefore a meat metaphor couldn´t be more suitable as it points out the cruelty of the prevailing mindset before and also after 1945.
Paul Cohen Oct 9, 2016:
No meat Yup, you might have to go for a vegan alternative.
Maureen Millington-Brodie (asker) Oct 9, 2016:
@all Many thanks for all the brainstorming, it's been very interesting, I don't think a translation involving meat idioms will work and now have a better idea of the sort of thing I need here but still pondering ...
seehand Oct 6, 2016:
bending and slanting Reading Paul's excerts I think this could also be a way to translate it - bending into the desired shape or really bending and slanting ...
Liane Poost Oct 6, 2016:
Indeed, as long as there is no English translation of that book available I wouldn't make up an English title. Just a translation in brackets would make sense. For the English readers.
Paul Cohen Oct 5, 2016:
(continued) Dieser "einfache Schreiner" erkannte bereits Jahre vor Kriegsausbruch die Zeichen der Zeit und stellte sich nicht wie die Attentäter vom 20. Juli aus opportunistischen Gründen erst 1944 gegen Hitler, als selbst die Führung der Wehrmacht erkennen musste, dass der oberste Feldherr der Deutschen den Krieg endgültig verloren hatte.

Ein "einfacher Schreiner" aus der Mitte der Gesellschaft als Widerstands- und Freiheitskämpfer gegen den Führer Adolf Hitler? Das kann oder besser gesagt, das darf nicht sein, schließlich heißt es doch immer: "Die einfachen Leute haben davon nichts gewusst." und "Was hätte ein Einzelner schon dagegen tun können?"

Der Autor porträtiert in seinem Buch das Leben eines zwar einfachen, aber aufrechten und geradlinigen Mannes. Vielleicht liegt es daran, dass Hans Georg Elser vor allem für alle sogenannten Mitläufer das personifizierte schlechte Gewissen darstellt. Daraus machen anständige Bürger nicht nur in Deutschland höchst ungern Helden, benennen Straßen oder Schulen nach ihnen oder bauen ein Denkmal zur Erinnerung.“
Paul Cohen Oct 5, 2016:
Why Georg Elser doesn't fit the mold While we're on the fascinating topic of Georg Elser (and why he doesn’t fit the mold), here's an excerpt from a review of the author's biography of the would-be Hitler assassin ("Den Hitler jag ich in die Luft." - no translation necessary for this readership):

„Der Attentäter Hans Georg Elser lässt sich nicht so einfach instrumentalisieren und von einer Gruppe vor den Karren spannen und er passt vor allem nicht in das stereotype Denkmuster, das in der Öffentlichkeit gezeichnet wird, wenn es in Deutschland um den Widerstand gegen das Dritte Reich und die nationalsozialistische Diktatur geht.

Denn bei den (berühmtesten) Widerstandskämpfern handelt es sich um Studenten und Intellektuelle, um Adlige, um Männer der Kirche und bürgerliche Unternehmer. Die Verschwörer und Attentäter des 20. Juli 1944 sollen zeigen, dass es sogar in der damaligen Wehrmachtselite Widerstand gegen Hitler gab und deshalb nicht alle Offiziere nur Befehle ausführten oder skrupellose Verbrecher waren.

Hans Georg Elser aber war nur ein "einfacher Schreiner".

(to be continued)
Paul Cohen Oct 5, 2016:
The answer is simple As Phil pointed out, there's normally no need to translate the titles of books and journal articles in footnotes. So the answer is simple: Don't translate it, for obvious reasons, one of which is that it's almost impossible to do a good job without knowing the exact nature of the work in question (and it gets really tricky if the title has a clever image or play on words). Are book translators expected to be intimately familiar with the nature of every book and article in the footnotes? No. Are we expected to translate these titles? Usually not.

But that's not the answer that the asker is looking for.

Brigitte and Thomas are on the right track here because, in contrast perhaps to some of the people offering answers to the question, they have actually read the article. I think "exploitation" works. Another word that comes to mind is "instrumentalization." In other words, making Georg Elser "fit the mold" (which, in essence, is what happens to meat when it's made into sausage; we grind it up and press it into a mold).
BrigitteHilgner Oct 5, 2016:
Continued So: the entertainment industry, politicians, greedy people trying to make a nice profit etc. won't be able to use Elser for their own purposes.
My interpretation.
BrigitteHilgner Oct 5, 2016:
Thomas Pfann, it's all your fault! Meaning: I've just read the article you managed to dig up and I have to confess that I find this kind of polemics hard to stomach.
But let's look at the facts:
"Knopps ZDF-Film über Elser (10.3.2004) setzte den ersten größeren Verwurstungsversuch in Gang. Genau neun Tage später schreckte der Münchner Marketingberater Peter Wittman die örtliche Presse mit der "Entdeckung" auf, er besitze ein von Georg Elser im KZ geschnitztes Schachspiel.
... Warum verkohlt uns ader heutige Besitzer? Ganz einfach: Er will 30.000 Euro.
... Zwei Tage nach dem Unsinnsartikel ... mischte sich ein Kommunalpolitiker ein: Für die 'Grüne Stadtratsfraktion und rosa Liste' stelle Siegfried Benker den Antrag, die Stadt möge 'das historische Schachspiel Georg Elsers für das Stadtmuseum erwerben'.
... Aber nun wollte auch das bayerische Fernsehen dabei sein. ...
Genug. Elser kann nicht verwurstet werden - oder noch nicht? Seine Klarsicht, seine unbeirrbare Konsequenz, sein Bruch mit dem nationalen Dünkel des Volkes werden ihn vor einer Verwurstung im Unterhaltungsbetrieb bewahren. Hoffentlich."
To be continued ...
Thomas Pfann Oct 5, 2016:
Verwursten does make sense here and I am sure the word has been very carefully chosen by the author. It's about making Elser into something that fits the mould, into something which is not necessarily who he really was. At one point in the text in question the author calls it "Elsers Verwertung für ein stromlinienförmiges Geschichtsbild".

Brigitte's suggestion of 'exploitation' might be a good fit.
Liane Poost Oct 5, 2016:
@ Thomas
But verwursten really doesn't make sense. I suppose the author meant verwursteln actually. Though, maybe he meant they have made a sausage out of that person. In any case he surely meant that they have made a mess.
Thomas Pfann Oct 5, 2016:
verwursteln ≠ verwursten Careful, verwursteln and verwursten are two different words with different meanings. Verwursten means to process [into sausauge], to mix up.

http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/verwursten
https://de.wiktionary.org/wiki/verwursten
Liane Poost Oct 5, 2016:
You may look there:
http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/verwurschteln
http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/wurscht

The meaning of verwurschteln is about "to make a mess of something".

(Wurst is a mess of different kinds of meat.)




Thomas Pfann Oct 4, 2016:
By the way... It doesn't seem to be a book title but the title of an article in a magazine. (Not that it makes much of a difference but at least that makes it easier to find out the gist of it.)

http://haasis-wortgeburten.anares.org/elser/elser3.php
Ramey Rieger (X) Oct 4, 2016:
Footnotes My approach to translating footnotes is to tranlsate only the publisher's data for books that have not been translated into English. Usually publishers have an international presence and those looking to cross reference will need the German title, as Phil already said.
BrigitteHilgner Oct 4, 2016:
exploitation? Without knowing the gist of the book, just a guess
Maureen Millington-Brodie (asker) Oct 4, 2016:
@Phil I've translated all the other titles (in brackets) after the original titles.
It doesn't seem to have had an English translation done so far as it isn't in the titles listed as available in English found so far.
philgoddard Oct 4, 2016:
Don't translate it. It's the title of a book. In the unlikely event that someone wants to follow up the reference, they'll need its German name.
Isabel Stainsby Oct 4, 2016:
Would something like 'making mincemeat of' work? It continues the meat theme.
Maureen Millington-Brodie (asker) Oct 4, 2016:
Thanks for that, no, I am not translating this book but another, and this title is listed in a footnote as a reference. The footnote is appended to a statement to the effect that 30 years on only the man's home village has named a street after him but not one German town has done so. You have however given me an idea and I will search to see if the book concerned has been translated and, if so, what it's title is.
AllegroTrans Oct 4, 2016:
Just a thought If you are translating this book I would imagine that your client would have already chosen the title. The German word literally translates into "making sausages" and would need to be rendered significantly differently in English. My experience is that many book titles end up completely different in foreign editions.

Proposed translations

21 mins

hack-up/mangling

Suggestions
Something went wrong...
14 hrs

salamification

Salami: a type of sausage

Interesting article. It seems that certain persons were intent on rubbishing his motives.

The vitiation of Hitler's most capable opponent
Something went wrong...
13 hrs

demolition

I would suggest for starters

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 01:51:30 GMT)
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chew-up

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 01:55:50 GMT)
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or more technical sounding: deconstruction

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 01:56:53 GMT)
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as in: wipe him out by discrediting him

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 01:57:29 GMT)
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and there's another idea: discreditation

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 01:58:42 GMT)
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might work

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 02:01:45 GMT)
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but has been pointed out, titles are so flexible and ultimately depend on the editor

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 02:03:38 GMT)
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my book was originally entitled "The Incessant Need" and ended up as "Power and Money" because the editor insisted on something more "marketable" boooo

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 02:06:22 GMT)
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"Wie kommt deine Mark in meine Tasche?" attitude

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Note added at 13 hrs (2016-10-05 02:08:17 GMT)
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so take your pick :)

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Note added at 16 hrs (2016-10-05 04:26:43 GMT)
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tearing apart but prefer demolition

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Note added at 16 hrs (2016-10-05 04:29:55 GMT)
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mangulation ... would be understood but a neologism ... but so what?

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Note added at 16 hrs (2016-10-05 04:30:30 GMT)
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editors love this sort of thing

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Note added at 16 hrs (2016-10-05 04:36:32 GMT)
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sad to be at the mercy of these "strategists"
Peer comment(s):
neutral Lancashireman : 13 afterthoughts? It's this sort of thing that makes askers turn off their e-mail notifications. And then the question never gets closed.
16 hrs
I don't see how afterthoughts affect the ongoing process of reaching a satisfactory conclusion and I have refrained in the past from addressing your arrogant attitude but it's time to put a stop to it .... you remind me of the tussles between Swisstel and
Something went wrong...
3 days 2 hrs

The Mincing of Georg Elser - Hitlers most capable opponent

The Mincing of Georg Elser - Hitlers most capable opponent
Something went wrong...
4 days

making sawdust of/cutting G.E. down to size

Hi there! I came very late to this one, been insanely busy. but perhaps this is a rational solution?
Something went wrong...
+1
7 days

Instrumentalization

"The Instrumentalization of Georg Elser, Hitler's Most Capable Opponent"

A meatless version, but as Michael pointed out, it cuts close to the bone. Indeed, anyone who reads the article is bound to conclude that it's about people who exploit Georg Elser for their own purposes (for profit, etc.), yet have little clue about who the man really was.

It’s not unusual to use instrumentalization this way. Titles such as “The Instrumentalization of Religion in Geopolitical Conflicts” are fairly common, particularly in academic circles.

As Liane so astutely pointed out, “Verwurstung” could also be seen as a synonym for “ausschlachten”, in which case a German definition that might apply here would be: (umgangssprachlich abwertend) bedenkenlos für seine Zwecke ausnutzen, i.e., to exploit (ruthlessly).

Hence, an alternative title might be (as Brigitte suggested):
"The Exploitation of Georg Elser, Hitler's Most Capable Opponent"

Just as you can't tell a book by its cover, most titles don’t reveal every facet of a work, and that can make translating them a mind-boggling task. Almost every title can be criticized in some way. But if you have to translate the title, I think this is a close approximation.

Peer comment(s):
agree Michael Martin, MA : Works for me.
36 mins
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+1
7 days

distorted legacy

Georg Elser - the distorted legacy of Hitler's most capable opponent.

Suggests he's been twisted and instrumentalized to fit people's liking
Peer comment(s):
agree Alexandra Timms (X) : I think "instrumentalization" and "exploitation" could work, but in my opinion this sounds nicer
10 hrs
Something went wrong...
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