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Capsule
Oct 30, 2008 14:42
15 yrs ago
French term

personnages imparfaits ou maudits par le destin

French to English Art/Literary Art, Arts & Crafts, Painting
On British artist William Hogarth, who painted and engraved narrative series, often portraying figures from everyday life and middle-class England.

So far, I have: Renowned for his narrative art portraying the imperfect and the damned...

But I think my "damned" is too harsh. More like "the unlucky in life", I think, but having a hard time finding a nice turn of phrase.
TIA

Célèbre pour ses récits en images mettant en scène des personnages imparfaits ou maudits par le destin, portraitiste, théoricien de l’art, William Hogarth fut un artiste novateur et ambitieux aux nombreuses facettes.
Proposed translations (English)
3 +5 life's misfits and underdogs
4 +1 [lower class] people leading flawed lives, mistreated by fortune...
3 +1 ill-fated
4 immoral and impoverished people
3 the flawed and nature's misfortunates
3 the forsaken, or those whom life has forsaken

Discussion

polyglot45 Oct 30, 2008:
it is more a case of imperfect and less fortunate" I think - From what I know of Hogarth, he wasn't into beautiful people, preferring to depict those not so fortunate i.e. human beings warts and all... "hum - warts and all"....
polyglot45 Oct 30, 2008:
it is more a case of imperfect and less fortunate" I think - From what I know of Hogarth, he wasn't into beautiful people, preferring to depict those less blessed with good fortune and human beings warts and all... "hum - warts and all"....
polyglot45 Oct 30, 2008:
it is more a case of imperfect and less fortunate" I think - From what I know of Hogarth, he wasn't into beautiful people, preferring to depict those not so fortunate i.e. human beings warts and all... "hum - warts and all"....
Sandra Mouton Oct 30, 2008:
Actually "maudits par le destin" is quite harsh in French too, so I think your 'the damned' is OK. IMO 'unlucky in life' would be an undertranslation.

Proposed translations

+5
32 mins
Selected

life's misfits and underdogs

Perhaps, although not sure about "underdogs".

My original idea was "the flotsam and jetsam of life" with the idea is of people washed up on life's shores, the dregs, the stuff that gets left behind... I guess it would be used more to describe things, paraphenalia, but perhaps it fits for people too.

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Note added at 54 mins (2008-10-30 15:36:23 GMT)
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I'm actually coming round to "underdogs" which the Webster defines as a victim of injustice, as life or fortune has been unjust with these people.

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Note added at 1 hr (2008-10-30 15:51:20 GMT)
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Life's misfits and unfortunates.

http://dictionnaire.reverso.net/anglais-cobuild/unfortunate
An unfortunate is someone who is unfortunate., n-count
Dorothy was another of life's unfortunates

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa5391/is_199810/ai_n2...
She was one of life's unfortunates forced to flee in fear of her life to another country.

http://www.word-detective.com/back-t.html
"Nebbish" is closely related to another Yiddish word for one of life's unfortunates, "schlemiel" (rhymes with "reveal"), but a schlemiel (a simpleton or misfit) can be disliked, while a nebbish must be pitied.


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Note added at 1 hr (2008-10-30 16:04:21 GMT)
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"misfits and misfortunates" for balance!
Note from asker:
Hi Sandra. Misfits was actually was I had originally put for imparfait, and I had also wondered about underdogs.
Peer comment(s):
agree Christopher Crockett : Yes, I definitely like "misfits" for "personnages imparfiats" --beter than my construction-- and also don't care for "underdogs."
6 mins
agree Sandra Mouton : I like 'misfits' too
10 mins
agree Mark Nathan : combined with Christopher's
30 mins
agree Jack Dunwell : Yes, S. Possibly "unfortunates"? (no fortune/fate) (some were grotesque)
1 hr
agree Susan Nicholls : what about misfits and failures, if not too colloquial?
6 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks for all the wonderful answers. In the end, I went with Sandra's great suggestion of: Life's misfits and unfortunates"
+1
4 mins

ill-fated

Translation of "[personnages] maudits par le destin"
Peer comment(s):
agree Sandra Mouton : I just saw your answer, it works too.
3 mins
neutral Christopher Crockett : The idea of "fate" is certainly close, but I really like polyglot45's introduction of "fortune" into the mix.
27 mins
Something went wrong...
16 mins

immoral and impoverished people

His themes were immorality and poverty.
Something went wrong...
+1
37 mins

[lower class] people leading flawed lives, mistreated by fortune...

Shamelessly Stealing polyglot45's use of "fortune" for "destin":

"Famous for his images of the daily life of lower class people leading flawed lives, mistreated by fortune..."

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Note added at 41 mins (2008-10-30 15:23:44 GMT)
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Siince I'm stealing, how about: "...images of life's misfits and those who have been mistreated by fortune..."

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Note added at 1 hr (2008-10-30 15:58:44 GMT)
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Kashew's point is well taken --a few of Hogarth's subjects were not (originally) from the lower classes.

"The Rake's Progress" chronicles a rich heir's Fall --perhaps as he is "mistreated by fortune" (or, perhaps, because he "mistreats fortune":

http://www.soane.org/rakesprogress.htm
Peer comment(s):
neutral kashew : There's some middle to upper class imperfects too!
23 mins
Certainly, and Hogarth's "Rake's Progress" chronicled one of those. Point taken. Thanks, kashew.
agree Mark Nathan : with your last suggestion
25 mins
Thanks, Mark.
Something went wrong...
1 hr

the flawed and nature's misfortunates

keep on brainstorming....
Something went wrong...
5 hrs

the forsaken, or those whom life has forsaken

an idea for the "maudits par le destin" since you already have the personnages imparfaits. It might have a religious connotation but then that wouldn't have been out of keeping with the Hogarth themes
Something went wrong...
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